Delhi blasts-why is there a mailing spree on?

It is a perfect ploy that has been adapted by these terrorist groups. A third email has been sent out in three days after the Delhi blasts and this gives a clear indication that the intention is to confuse investigating agencies.
There is a bit insanity in the manner in which this case is being probed today. Every theory has wrong till date. The get away car which they thought was the vehicle of terror turned out to be stolen car and had nothing to do with the crime. Secondly the sketches which were drawn out in a hurry turned out to be wrong images according to the NIA. This has now prompted them to put out a new sketch. The interrogation of the various men who have been picked up till date in connection with the blast is moving at a very slow pace. These are just suspects and investigating agencies say that they are looking for leads from them although prima facie it does not appear they were directly connected with the crime.
The email culture after a blast which was made famous by the Indian Mujahideen was once a weapon for the police. However today it has become a nightmare since it is taking the police a step backward. On day one they were on the HuJi trail based on the mail. The mail clearly states that the judiciary would be under attack and that was the theory that they were working on. The probe did go in one particular direction and some members of the HuJi were even picked up.
The second day however there was another mail that was sent out which took the NIA into another spin and they started to explore the IM angle since this mail was alleged to have been sent by the outfit. Just when this angle was being probed there came another mail today which speaks about carrying out an attack in Ahmedabad.
What such mails tend to do is throw the investigating agency off guard and the resources are more about safeguarding the city. Moreover despite the IM being down today, the police have learnt from the Ahmedabad blasts experience where a mail was sent out a couple of minutes before the attack warning about the blasts.
The IM had the most sophisticated technical cell and they used technology to their advantage. They played the cat and mouse game with the police very well with the police and did manage success to a large extent. The likes of Mansoor Pheerbhoy may be arrested and Abdus Subhan absconding, but that it not good enough to say that they technical cell has been busted. There are many more boys who are out on the lose who are capable of sending such mails bouncing them off proxy servers.
Sources in the investigating team say that this is the third mail till date and it cannot be merely dismissed as mischief. Whoever is sending them out has a motive behind it and it could all have been sent from one place while bouncing them off servers of different places. A mischief monger may not take such a big risk of dealing with a case of terrorism knowing fully well what the consequences are. Although the person sending out the mail may not have anything to do with the attack, he would be still interested in sending it out to confuse the investigators. A couple of boys from the IM are capable of this since they would be trying to send out a message that they are still active. Although they may have not carried out this attack they would still want to show that they are in business. The NIA is in touch with Google for more details on the mail and are expecting some answers in the next couple of days.
The probe today is centric around these mails since the police believe that there could be more to it. Apart from trying and finding out the origins, they would also study the pattern. For starters it does not appear to be a typical mail that an IM would send out. However one cannot rule out the possibility of a change in strategy, investigating authorities also pointed out.

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US has a bigger Lashkar threat today

For the Lashkar-e-Tayiba there is no bigger ambition today but to strike at the United States of America. There has been talk for quite sometime now that the group is trying to wriggle slightly out of India and focus on the United States of America while it would let its sister concern the Harkat-ul-Jihadi carry out the India operations.
Lashkar continues to be the pet outfit of the ISI till date since there has not really been a defiance on its part. However the trouble began ever since the 26/11 attack and the lead up to it. A large part of the cadres in the Lashkar were looking to get into Afghanistan and also planning a strike on the United States. However this was not approved by the ISI which then assured them of a bigger attack. Hence the plan originally laid down by the Al-Qaeda’s 313 Brigade was hijacked and handed over to the Lashkar.
However the intelligence inputs from India on the operations of the Lashkar gives the clear indication that the trouble has begun once again. Today in fact the anger is two fold following the death of Osama Bin Laden. There are a large number of cadres in the Lashkar who feel that the death of Osama needs to be avenged.
The Lashkar sees a perfect opportunity today to take over the reigns of the Al-Qaeda post Osama Bin Laden. Laden was more of a glue for the Al-Qaeda and there was unity in the group. Today after his death, there is a lot of chaos within the group and the leadership of Ayman Al Zawahari has not done much good. The outfit has split into many factions and there is not one guiding force to keep the cadres united.
This change in situation has made many within the Lashkar more anxious. They believe that it was the Al-Qaeda which was capable of rattling the US and if that outfit is going down the drain, then the battle against the US is lost.
There is a growing rebellion today within the ranks of the Lashkar. An expert on the Lashar, Stephen Tankel would point out that the Lashkar has a deep rooted network and it is in the best position today to attack the US when compared to the rest of the groups.
These changes and the rebellion have made the ISI nervous. They have managed to contain the Lashkar a great deal and would not want it meddling with the United States of America as of now. The ISI itself is trying its best to clear its name in the international community and if the Lashkar were to go on the lose and strike at the US then it sure would mark the downfall of the US.
The clear message given to the Lashkar is to continue focusing on Kashmir and other India based operations. They would prefer to engage the Lashar more in Kashmir since they also feel this is a justifiable fight. However striking at the US would mean doom for the ISI in particular.
Despite so many problems as of now, the ISI still considers the Lashkar to be its favourite group. Unlike the rest of the groups which parted ways with the ISI and turned rogue the Lashkar has always remained faithful. The ISI would do everything to quell a rebellion.
The Indian Intelligence Bureau however says that the capabilities of the Lashkar has gone up two fold. The fact that they were able to train an American like David Headley to carry out terror strikes is just one indication of what their capabilities are. They for sure have many more David Headleys who would try and hit out at the US.
In addition to this they have also entered into a perfect relation with the underworld which has helped them set up a proper channel. They are using the drug routes used by the underworld to carry out terrorism. They have cadres in India, Nepal, Bangladesh, Thailand, United States of America, London, Nigeria apart from a host of other countries. In the above mentioned countries they even have a dedicated network. In addition to this they also have at their disposal slick operatives such as Sajid Mir who does don the role of an international terrorist. Hence when one talks about the capabilities of the Lashkar it is evident that they have an edge over the rest and in the years to come they will continue to be a nightmare for the United of States of America which just did away with the Al-Qaeda menace very recently.

We lose $114 billion due to cyber crime

114 billion dollars- that is the cost of global cyber crime. A study conducted by Norton reveals this scary picture.

Based on the value victims surveyed placed on time lost due to their cybercrime experiences, an additional $274 billion was lost.In India it is estimated that more than 29.9 million people fell victim to cybercrime last year, suffering $4 billion in direct financial losses and an additional $3.6 billion in time spent resolving the crime.

With 431 million adult victims globally in the past year and at an annual price of $388 billion globally based on financial losses and time lost, cybercrime costs the world significantly more than the global black market in marijuana, cocaine and heroin combined ($288 billion).

According to the Norton Cybercrime Report 2011 more than two thirds of online adults (69 percent) have been a victim of cybercrime in their lifetime. Every second 14 adults become a victim of cybercrime, resulting in more than one million cybercrime victims every day.

In India, four in five online adults (80 percent) have been a victim of cybercrime. For the first time, the Norton Cybercrime Report reveals that 10 percent of adults online globally (17 percent in India) have experienced cybercrime on their mobile phone.

The number of reported new mobile operating system vulnerabilities increased, from 115 in 2009 to 163 in 2010. In addition to threats on mobile devices, increased social networking and a lack of protection are likely to be some of the main culprits behind the growing number of cybercrime victims.

Male, Millennial, MobileThe study identifies men between 18 and 31 years old who access the Internet from their mobile phone as even more likely victims: in this group four in five (80 percent) have fallen prey to cybercrime in their lifetime. Globally, the most common – and most preventable – type of cybercrime is computer viruses and malware with 54 percent of respondents saying they have experienced it in their lifetime. Viruses are followed by online scams (11 percent) and phishing messages (10 percent). Earlier this year the Symantec Internet Security Threat Report, Volume 16, found more than 286 million unique variations of malicious software (“malware”) compared to the 240 million reported in 2009, representing a 19 percent increase.[vi] “There is a serious disconnect in how people view the threat of cybercrime,” said Gaurav Kanwal, Country Sales Manager for India and SAARC, Consumer Business Unit, Symantec. “Cybercrime is much more prevalent than people realize. Over the past 12 months, three times as many adults surveyed have suffered from online crime versus offline crime, yet less than a third of respondents think they are more likely to become a victim of cybercrime than physical world crime in the next year. And while 89 percent of respondents agree that more needs to be done to bring cybercriminals to justice, fighting cybercrime is a shared responsibility. It requires us all to be more alert and to invest in our online smarts and safety.” The disconnect between awareness and action is further illustrated by the fact that while 74 percent of respondents say they are always aware of cybercrime, many are not taking the necessary precautions. 41 percent of the adults indicated they don’t have an up to date security software suite to protect their personal information online. In addition, less than half review credit card statements regularly for fraud (47 percent), and 61 percent don’t use complex passwords or change them regularly. Among those who access the Internet via their mobile phone, only 16 percent install the most up to date mobile security.

HuJI vs IM- who is stronger?

There are two mails which claim responsibility for the Delhi blasts- one by the HuJI and the other by the Indian Mujahideen. It is a whole other story whether these mails are authentic or not. While the National Investigating Agency says that they are taking these mails seriously, the intelligence bureau says it appears to be more of a prank, but yet it will be verified.
While speaking to investigators looking into this case it becomes clear that there is no concrete lead as yet and to be fair on them it is too early to say that they are groping in the dark. The bigger question now is whether it is the HuJI or the IM which has carried out this attack. Who has an interest in this attack and who has better capabilities.
On Wednesday investigators chased the HuJI operatives and today they seem to be behind the IM. As of today the HuJI looks like a better prepared outfit when compared to the Indian Mujahideen. HuJI has been banned no doubt and its wings clipped a great deal, but when compared to the IM it sure does have better capabilities.
The IM on the other hand comprised young blood and had become a formidable force to reckon with. However their bravado is what did them in and looking at the manner in which they operated it became evident that they were literally challenging and inviting the police to their door step which ultimately did them in.
Once again while comparing the two outfits, the HuJI has a better network in place when compared to the IM. The modules of the IM are in tatters and while there are fringe elements who are capable of carrying out attacks, there is no coordination due to the lack of cadres.
The HuJI on the other hand had gone quiet in India after the twin blasts at Hyderabad an operation carried out by Shahid Bilal. There was a lot of heat on the outfit following that blast and the police did manage to bust a couple of their cells and modules in Southern India. However the police were unable to do a better job when it came to busting their modules in their strongest state of West Bengal.
The Indian Mujahideen depended heavily on sophisticated cadres who were tech savvy and educated, but in the case of HuJI they went for people who were more in need of money. The IM believed in an ideology, but HuJI depended more on a general warfare pattern and would carry out an attack for the mere revenge.
However when one looks at the Delhi blasts, prima facie it appears that it is the IM which has a bigger interest in this city when compared to HuJI. The Batla House encounter for the cadres of the IM is a bigger incident than Babri or Godhra and the latest recruitments have been largely done by whipping up that sentiment. Moreover the IM which has branched out of the SIMI is very upset with the ban. It does blame the judiciary a great deal for this ban to continue and could have a possible interest in carrying out an attack over there. The Batla House encounter will however continue to be the favourite whipping point for the IM and any attempt to embrass the Delhi police in particular would be welcome to all its cadres.
The HuJI on the other hand is trying to become another Lashkar-e-Tayiba and wants to set up its foot hold on Indian affairs. There is a conscious bifurcation in terms of India operations and with the Lashkar trying to go international it chose its sister concern the HuJi to handle India. If one were to analyse the interest that HuJI had in an immediate attack in Delhi one would have to connect it with the Kashmir issue. In this respect if one were to look at it the HuJI mail sent yesterday does tend to make a lot of sense. Afzal Guru is what they have quoted and this is an extremely sentimental issue in the Valley. Reports by both the army and the IB have gone on to show that the existing terror groups had been successful in the Valley in the past due to various sentimental issues they whipped out and also they had some local support. The HuJI which will take over from the Lashkar could have possibly tried to make a start of its Kashmir operations through these blasts.
Going by the capabilities of both the groups now it is clear that the HuJI is stronger as of today. This looks like a very small attack for HuJI standards and more importantly their leader, Ilyas Kashmiri is not a man of small operations. The IB points out that this could be either a hurried operation or an attack just to test the waters after nearly 3 years of carrying out an attack. Groups such as the HuJI would ideally like to attack bigger establishments such as embassys and would ensure that the casualties are huge. Moreover they have been training more in Fidayeen styled attacks and a bomb blast by them is quite a strange operation.
The IM on the other hand is very capable of such an attack and there are still some cadres on the lose who can carry out such self motivated attacks and despite them being down they can never be ruled out. Unlike the HuJi they are not capable of carrying out a Fidayeen strike on bigger establishments. However in places which have lower security and also crowded areas they could still be a formidable force to reckon with.

PETN- is it a new choice?

The presence of Pentaerythritol Tetranitrate (PETN) in the Delhi bomb has given the investigating agencies an entirely new dimension to the case. This is probably for the first time that a terrorist group has used PETN in a blast in India, a country which has seen a series of attacks in which only RDX and ammonium nitrate were used.

For quite some time terrorists had stopped using RDX and had relied heavily on ammonium nitrate which was easily available. However in the Delhi blasts the forensics team claims to have found traces of PETN which goes on to indicate that a bigger group was behind this attack.

PETN is not easily available and is a deadly explosive. It has been used by bigger groups such as the Lashkar-e-Tayiba and also the Al-Qaeda in the past. In several cases where PETN has been used it becomes clear that these groups had smuggled it from various countries and have stocked it at their base camps accorss the Indian border.

Forensic science experts say that it is a very powerful explosive and infact can create a similar impact that an RDX could create. PETN is normally mixed with a plasticizer and attached to an IED to trigger the bomb which creates a massive impact.

While the impact of the blast using PETN is a big factor for terrorists to use, the other more important factor is that when it is made into a bomb, the detection is extremely difficult since it cannot be detected easily. This is largely due to the plastic nature of the bomb and also the fact that it has low pressure molecules which make it hard for sniffer dogs too to detect. Another reason why security officials find it difficult to detect PETN is because it has very low vapour pressure in room temperature.

Sources say that the procurement of PETN is not difficult for terrorist groups. It is very much manufactured in India and like all other explosive material if a group puts its heart into it then they can easily procure it. However in India there are various regulations regarding PETN and it is not all that easy to source. When it comes to RDX, there are hardly any instances to show that it has been procured from India. It is always provided by the Pakistani establishment to terror groups and later it is smuggled into India. This could be very much the case in PETN since the history of the use of this substance would show that it has been used by bigger terrorist groups.

Security officials point out that the use of PETN has been found extensively only in the Jammu and Kashmir area. Terrorists are able to easily smuggle it from across the border. In this case the probe has reached the Valley and the procurement procedure of PETN will be an interesting angle to study. Moreover in the Delhi blasts the amount of PETN which was used was very less and this would have made it easier for the terrorists to procure. Intelligence Bureau officials say that the trend is a new one and gives the indication that terror groups are looking to increase the intensity of the blasts in the days to come.

It may be recalled during the trial of the case pertaining to the bombing of the RSS office at Chennai the use of PETN was greatly discussed. While the trial court had accepted the version of the police that PETN and RDX were used in the blasts, the appeal before the Supreme Court of India rejected this theory. However the theory of PETN being used in that blast was rejected since the investigating officers were unable to prove the origin of the PETN.

HuJI links probed further

The NIA has zeroed down the investigation to the Harkat Ul Jihadi angle. Four suspected HuJi men have been arrested in Lucknow and Faisabad in connection with the Delhi blasts.
Khalid Mujahid, tariq qazmi, sajjadur rehman and khalid rehman are the four men who are at present in the custody of the UP police. Although there is no confirmation as yet avout their connection with the blasts, the police will grill them for leads. Two of these men who belong to the Kashmir region will also be interrogated by the NIA shortly.
NIA sources say that they are seeking the help of the Jammu and Kashmir police for further leads. Although the HuJI has a small presence in the valley, there have been intel reports of them trying to set up base over there.
The email too has been tracked to a cyber cafe in Kashmir. It is found that the mail was sent from a cyber cafe from Kashmir and bpunced off a proxy server from South africa. However the NIA also doesn’t rule out a prank in this issue.

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Police cannot be lazy any longer

There is absolute confusion among the investigating agencies regarding the Delhi blasts today. The mail which was sent out earlier today is the only lead that investigators have got, but there is a lurking suspicion regarding the authenticity of that mail.
A twenty member team of the National Investigating Agency has already commenced its probe and are now waiting for the results of the Forensic Sciences Laboratory which is examining the bomb composition. Although the composition will be known in a couple of days, it may not really help the agency zero down on any particular outfit.
A couple of years back terror groups had a signature style of an attack. The bombs assembled during the twin blasts in Hyderabad gave all possible vital leads to the police since the bomb that was assembled bore a signature. Intelligence Bureau officials say that each terror group had a signature styled bomb and it had become easier to track the outfit. The SIMI, IM, HuJI all had their own style of packaging and also planting a bomb.
However today that scenario has changed and terror groups have become extremely careful to reveal their identity when an attack has been carried out. Earlier terror groups wanted their identity to be known since it was a matter of pride for them as its gave them a sense of bravado. Today the terror scenario has changed a great deal and terror groups prefer to keep their identity concealed.
This change has basically made the investigation a nightmare for the police. Blast cases will not be easy to investigate in the days to come. It has become a cat and mouse game between these terror groups and the police and the latter are sure going to find it very difficult to crack these cases. A police officer pointed out that now a days with each blast the investigations need to start from scratch unlike the past where they could rely heavily on information obtained from earlier blasts. The blasts earlier had a connection and all the police needed to do was to join the dots. Moreover when the Indian Mujahideen carried out blasts, they also gave the police the privilage of a full fledged mail which gave the first lead. Now this too is missing and terror groups have become smarter and try their best to conceal their identity as much as possible.
Police sources say that they will have to rely much more on human intelligence in the days to come. These blasts which are taking place may not be undertaken by full fledged terror groups and could be the handi work of one or two people. This would mean that the police will have go back and rely upon the age old tactics to crack the case. This means that they will have to activate their sources on the ground (anti social elements) and seek information from them. They will also have to place reliance very heavily on the statements given by those people present before the blast to find out if they saw anything suspicious. Basically to cut a long story short the police will have to get on to the field and investigate the matter right from scratch. Each of the latest incidents of terror would need to be treated as a fresh case and the investigations need to be independent in nature. There is no point in relying on signatures and also information from previous blasts because at the moment one thing is clear and that is none of these blasts in the past two years are inter-connected.

Terror mail bounced of South Africa

The email sent out allegedly by the Harkat-ul-Jihadi claiming responsibility for the Delhi attack is under investigation. Sources in the intelligence bureau say that the mail was sent out from India itself but bounced off a proxy server from South Africa.
These are early leads and there are experts on the job an IB official said. The mail which was sent out claimed responsibility for the attack and also warned that it would even attack the Supreme Court if Afzal Guru’s mercy plea was not accepted.
Sources say that while the HuJI link is under the scanner, we are still to come to a final conclusion. All angles are open as of now, a police official said.
The IB meanwhile continues to study the mail. It appears to have come out of South Africa, but we are certain it was sent out locally. Further it is also being ascertained whether the mail was actually sent out by the HUjI or by mischief makers. However one thing is sure and that a professional had ubdertaken this excercise, the IB says.
Another angle that is being probed is whether a radical group from North East carried out the attack. We do not see any immediate motive for any terror group to carry out the attack, but the HuJI angle looks the strongest at the moment and that is only due to the mail.

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Impact of blast points to professional bomb maker

Initial reports would suggest that the bomb composition had ammonium nitrate, but when one looks at the 4 feet crater the use of RDX cannot be ruled out too.
Forensic Sciences experts say that if at all it is ascertained that ammonium nitrate has been used in this attack then one could say that the bomb was made by a professional and the packaging was heavy.
The first leads go on to indicate that the explosives were being carried in a suit case. The question now is how much explosives could have been carried in a suit case. According to the experts if the bomb was prepared with the help of RDX, then it would be a maximum of half a kilogram. Moreover when it comes to RDX it is easier to load a heavy quantity since RDX does not need any container to trigger off a blast. All that is required is it should be wrapped in a piece of and a timer device attached. Further when one looks at the case on hand and also the impact that the bomb has created (four feet crater) one gets the feeling that it was RDX.
However the bigger question is whether terrorist groups were ready to risk using RDX considering the kind of scrutiny there is regarding this. Terrorist groups have virtually stopped using RDX when they carry out attacks in cities since it tends to increase the heat on them. They have been using ammonium nitrate a great deal thanks to the lack of regulation and also the easy availability of the material.
Forensic experts say if ammonium nitrate was used in the Delhi blasts then going by the impact it becomes clear that it was assembled thoroughly and by a professional. For a blast of this nature at least half a kilogram of Ammonium Nitrate would have been needed and this was the quantity that could have been inside the suitcase. Moreover they would have had to keep the quantity down and going by the impact it gives the impression that the packaging was very good. When one uses ammonium nitrate in a blast the impact largely depends on the steel container or the piple in which it is concealed. If this blast could create a crater of 4 feet then the packaging was exceptional forensic experts point out. It looks like a bigger operation than just trying to kill and injure people. They had planted it in the car park and ensured that it had a big impact so that the vehicles could catch fire and create more chaos. Hence the impact was not meant to be wide as was in the 13/7 case, experts also say.
If it is ascertained that the bomb had ammonium nitrate in it then it would be interesting to draw a comparison to the 13/7 blasts. In that case the bomb was packed in a steel container. It was a very loosely packed bomb and moreover kept in an open place and hence the impact was lower. Moreover when bombs are placed in an open area it is designed in such a way that it creates a wider impact. This would mean that the shrapnel that is packed with the explosive needs to fly a distance so that it can hit as many people as possible.
However in the Delhi blast it appears that the bomb was packed in such a way to create an impact in close quarters and in order to make a powerful bomb it is likely that the material was packed in steel pipes which makes the impact stronger. Yet again speaking of an ammonium nitrate composition experts say that elaborate preparation would have been required in making this bomb which has high impact.
The Central Foresnsic Sciences team which is looking into the bomb composition will have to ascertain the packaging of the bomb apart from the material used. They would look into the metallic pieces that have been used in the making of this bomb. Apart from this the IED too would be important since it is the main device which triggers of the bomb.

The HuJi dossier

There is a fresh alert regarding a Harkat-ul-Jihadi angle to the Delhi blasts. It is now being claimed that this outfit which operates out of Bangladesh had carried out these blasts in order to protest the hanging of Afzal Guru.
While this is a very premature revealation, the National Investigating Agency says that it will probe this angle as well since at this moment no claims can be dismissed. A twenty member team of the NIA will be probing the various angles attached to this blast and a crucial angle would be the one pertaining to the HuJI.
The question now is how strong is the HuJI as of today and would they be willing to undertake a blast at this moment considering the fact there is so much heat on them internationally.
A year ago the United States had imposed a ban on the Bangladesh based HuJI following which their activities had come down. However a month ago the HuJI had been making attempts to regroup and there were various instances to show that their activities were becoming India centric.
In this regard it may be recalled that their first attempt to wreck havoc after the ban on them was when they gave an open threat to bomb the Pakistan embassy in New Delhi. The plan according to the Intelligence Bureau was clear that they were ready to let the HuJI carry out more activity in India while it was planning on concentrating on international ventures.
In this regard it would also be interesting to study the latest dossier of the IB on the HuJi which makes a very clear mention that activity in India by this outfit is on the rise and in the past six months they have recruited nearly 200 personnel mainly from West Bengal. There is also an added record to show that some 150 persons from WB had gone missing during this period. The dots of this are still being joined by the investigating agencies. The dossier further goes on to point out that the HujI apart from carrying out bomb blasts in India were also looking for some high profile abductions.
The message that has been put out allegedly by the HuJI today concerns Afzal Guru. While this could just an open ended statement one must not also lose track of the fact that such statements only will help this outfit further their battle in Kashmir. It is a very possible angle but again too early to come to any conclusion, the IB says.
The other angle with regard to HuJI which is being spoken about is whether the growing ties between Bangladesh and India. These ties had put the breaks on the operation of the HuJI and even on the border their operations had become difficult to carry out. Moreover there was cooperation between the security forces of the two countries which was also making operations difficult.
The IB confirms that the activities of the HuJI were on the rise and their recruitment drive was at an all time high. They have appointed foot soldiers and also suicide bombers by paying nearly 10 to 15 lakh and this would go on to show that they were serious about their India operation.
Apart from the recruitments they have also managed to set up several sleeper cells and modules in West Bengal which can be activated at any time.
Looking at the Delhi attack and if it is established that it was the HuJI after all then the thing that investigators would have to also look into is the timing of the attack. The HujI usually plans things on a higher scale and this appears to be a more hurried attack. It looks like that they were testing the waters and also used the Prime Minister’s visit to Bangladesh as an excuse. However they were careful enough not to say that out openly and stuck to the Afzal Guru issue since that is a more emotive one.